Stories from ADHD camp

Danielle attends an ADHD camp in Michigan and hears stories from several women about being diagnosed with ADHD later in life. Many of them have one thing in common. 

More on this story: 

• I’m sure my mom has ADHD. Should I tell her?

• What is the ADHD tax?

• “Who are we missing?” One doctor’s lifelong fight for women with ADHD

Danielle: Here's a not-at-all fun fact: The average attention span has dropped from 12 seconds to eight seconds in the last 25 years or so. We are all increasingly struggling to focus. The writer Johann Hari attempts to reckon with this phenomenon in his 2022 book, "Stolen Focus: Why You Can't Pay Attention and How to Think Deeply Again." I read it in 2023, after a guy I was seeing recommended it. He was in the middle of wrestling with his own ADHD symptoms.

Anyway, the author of the book moved to a seaside town as an experiment. He cooked for himself. He walked everywhere. He read a daily newspaper and read books. He left his smartphone at home and called his family from a landline. Essentially, he lived in his immediate surroundings. Within weeks, he felt like his old self. He could think clearly and write for sustained periods of time. He enjoyed conversations with strangers. Outside of the pace of modern life, his symptoms ebbed.

After three months, he left this little paradise and set out to find reasons why it's so hard to achieve this feeling in regular life. He found that many forces beyond our control are sort of short-circuiting our brains. Things like pollution in the air, chemicals in our food, tech companies creating addictive products. In essence, the conditions of modern life are not good for our brains, neurotypical and neurodivergent brains alike. And many of the habits of modern lives aren't good either.

To be clear, "Stolen Focus" is not about ADHD. But, the book hones in on what Ned calls our ADD-ogenic culture and why more people might be developing what he called environmentally-induced ADHD.

That is to say, the way we live these days is manifesting ADHD-like symptoms, even for people who do not have ADHD. Does accepting this fact open the door for greater numbers of misdiagnoses? Yes. But, for those who truly have ADHD, it reveals how severely modern life might be intensifying ADHD symptoms.

About two weeks after I shared dinner with the Hallowells and talked myself into an unexpected invitation, I showed up at their camp. The ADHD family camp was being held at a boarding school in Northern Michigan. As I pulled onto the school grounds, I realized the decision to go there was pretty impulsive. And now that I was there, I didn't have much of a plan.

I had hoped, at the very least, to spend the week connecting with women with ADHD. Maybe a few who were recently diagnosed. But beyond that, I didn't really know what to expect. I got there towards the end of check-in and walked up at the same time as a family.

Sue: Hello. How are you guys?

Danielle: The mom apologized for being late.

Sue: That's OK. This is ADD land. We don't expect everybody on time.

Danielle: We don't expect everybody on time. The Hallowells' camp is, for the most part, outside of the pace of modern life, outside of our ADD-ogenic culture. It's Ned's Vermont, or the author's seaside town from "Stolen Focus." It's a week in the woods in a beautiful place where kids can run around and parents can connect with each other. In other words, it's a pretty ideal setting for people with ADHD and their families.

But even here, as I talk to these women, women from all over the world who had decided this was a safe enough space to speak candidly about their experiences, the stories of their struggles felt real and immediate. No matter their background or experience, they were all voicing a desire for more awareness and better treatment.

Through my conversations at the camp, I started to see how much more needs to be done if there's to be any hope of reaching all the women who stand to benefit from knowing a name for the way their brain works. In this episode, I'm going to share four of those conversations.

This is "Climbing the Walls," a podcast where I try to figure out why so many women are being diagnosed with ADHD. I'm Danielle Elliot.

The first morning of camp, the kids went off on some sort of outdoor adventure, and the parents met for a group session with Sue Hallowell. They gathered in a large conference room and pushed the tables into a big U. Sue stood at the front and asked the parents to introduce themselves. The first woman said her wife was recently diagnosed with ADHD. A few more moms said they were diagnosed in the last few years. Some discovered their ADHD after their kids were diagnosed or through TikTok videos.

One of the women shared something I've never heard before. Her mom was diagnosed with Alzheimer's, and she went in for a screening. In the course of that screening, the doctor diagnosed ADHD. Her daughters were later diagnosed. About two-thirds of the way through the introductions, a woman looked a bit nervous. As soon as she spoke, I understood why.

Tamsin: Well, I got diagnosed with AHD two weeks ago.

Danielle: I caught up with her a few hours later to see how she was feeling.

Tamsin: When I first came in this morning and saw everyone in here I felt like I had a big like neon light with ADHD like flashing arrow pointing at my head like everyone's gonna know because because like I'm just so aware of it, like everything I'm doing or saying or thinking I'm reanalyzing the way I am in the world, so that's kind of weird. But I'm glad I'm doing it in this environment where other people are aware of that everyone, or a lot of people here, have ADHD. I think the timing was good.

Danielle: Her name is Tamsin. She's from the UK and lives in California with her husband and their two children, who both have ADHD. They'd booked the trip months earlier in hopes of finding ways to support their kids and create more harmony in their family.

Tamsin: And then, yeah, just by chance, I got diagnosed with ADHD as well.

Danielle: By chance. For several months, a doctor had been treating Tamsin for depression. She was taking antidepressants, but was having trouble with them.

Tamsin: I was really suffering badly from withdrawals, so I went to a psychiatrist to find out about getting off the antidepressants, and she just diagnosed me with ADHD and then I went back and had some more assessments and tests, and yeah, I was just really blindsided by it, really shocked. But as soon as I thought about it, even a little bit, I was like, how could I get to 48 and not have any idea, you know, like two kids with ADHD, you know, I've worked in mental health, you know my brother's a teacher. I just was completely blindsided by it.

Danielle: Tamsin had been seeing a therapist before seeing the psychiatrist. When she got the diagnosis, she talked to her therapist about how they missed it.

Tamsin: We kind of came to the conclusion it's because when, so I'm 48, and I had a parent that was narcissistic, you know, had some trauma, I'm now perimenopausal, I've got kids with ADHD, I had like I think six years of IVF treatments, you now, I mean I'm an average 48 year old woman, like I've got massive like life stuff behind me. So, was it, was the way I am in the world any, all of that, or was it ADHD?

Danielle: These questions come up so often in adult diagnosis. Is it perimenopause? Is it a result of years of trauma? Is it just the way we are in the world? Or is it ADHD? For decades, doctors erred on the side of it being everything else: Depression, anxiety, bipolar disorder, menopause, life. Hearing that Tamsin's psychiatrist instead recognized the symptoms of ADHD and knew how to properly assess her experience seems like a sign of progress.

She didn't bring the information to her doctor. Her doctor suggested it and treated her appropriately. Progress. I should add, this is one woman's experience. Another woman at camp told me her doctor refused to consider ADHD and kept insisting she actually had anxiety. She had to switch doctors. So, receiving appropriate care still happens on a case-by-case basis. But for Tamsin, someone finally connected the dots, and that brought her a lot of relief.

Tamsin: So much of my life now makes sense, like decisions I've made, friendships I've had, careers I've chosen, laundry piles, like so much makes sense.

Danielle: But the diagnosis also brought on some new fears.

Tamsin: And I think the worst bit is worrying that people in my life are going to say, "Oh, now we know what the problem was. It was you." Like, that's my biggest fear of being like, "Oh, now we can like... you know, every argument I've ever had, oh, it's because you're shit." But I'm also learning that like, that's part of the ADHD as well, is like feeling that everything is my fault and I'm just not doing something quite right.

Danielle: She's beginning to understand that inner negativity. And she told me she hoped to learn more during her week at this camp.

Sue: Elaine, you ready?

Elaine: Yes. OK.

Sue: OK.

Danielle: During another parent session, Sue Hallowell paused the discussion to introduce a woman named Elaine. Elaine is a volunteer who runs an arts room at the camp. She wanted to tell the group about the arts project they could try that week, and why art is a great outlet for people with ADHD. But first, she needed something from the group.

Elaine: And I'm going to ask you to do something that's going to sound very, very egotistical on my part, but I just need this. I am celebrating 35 years of being a nurse this year. And I just, in the worst way, need someone to clap for me.

Danielle: The applause lasted more than two minutes.

Elaine: Thank you, that will never happen to me again. That meant a lot to me. You don't know me, but you were willing to say, "Good job, yay!" And that made me feel great. So, we're going to help each other...

Danielle: Elaine went on to share her story with the group. She said she'd learned a lot about herself since being diagnosed with ADHD. Well, not at first. At first, she ignored her diagnosis. She was busy taking care of her four kids and her husband, and with work. She's a school nurse in a rural part of Michigan. Then, a few years ago, within a span of two months, all of her kids moved out of their house, and her husbands started working a night shift.

Elaine: So, if I had an audio right now, I would push the button that said crickets chirping because I was like a deer in the headlight. You know what I'm saying? I was just like what in the world am I supposed to do? My whole identity was always in being a nurse, but being a mother. So, the things that held me up to make me feel like I was somebody worthwhile, were falling apart. I'm sorry if I cry. So, what I did was I said, "I got to do something." Either I'm going to learn to do some stuff and rework my life, or I'm gonna fall apart. And falling apart is just never a good option, you know? So.

Danielle: Elaine stumbled into art, but the story I'm really hearing is how she started to grapple with her ADHD. Later, I caught up with her to ask more. She told me that she started to recognize her ADHD after her son was diagnosed. It took a while for a doctor to diagnose him.

Elaine: We live in an area that is very underserved, very like low income, so most people can't find people to diagnose them or have the money to be able to do the things that they need to do in order to get help. So, it's just so hard to get the right people to listen and to help and to believe that ADHD is a thing, you know?

Danielle: It took a while to get her son's diagnosis and even longer to get his own. And when she did, she felt like she didn't have time to deal with it.

Elaine: But then I kind of put it aside for a while. Because sometimes you just don't have the bandwidth to do it all. You're like, I know that this probably applies to me, but I'm too busy working and being a mom, and I just can't get to it right now, you know? You put your family first, you put other things first. And then until you kind of get into this spot where "I've got to do something, because I don't feel good." You know what I'm saying? And this isn't going to get better.

Danielle: Eventually, she found Ned Hallowell's podcast and reached out to him.

Elaine: I was feeling kind of insecure, and I thought it would be nice to write to somebody who would understand how I felt.

Danielle: They emailed a few times, and he mentioned camp.

Elaine: "I have this camp in Michigan, and I live in Michigan." So, I was like, I have to go and volunteer. I've got to do this. I honestly felt like, it was like I'm supposed to do this.

Danielle: This is her fourth year at the camp. She keeps coming back because it gives her a chance to connect and to overcome the lack of access to appropriate care in the area where she lives. She wouldn't be able to afford to be here if she weren't volunteering. It's not an opportunity most women in her situation can replicate.

As part of her role at the camp, Elaine helps the other parents connect with each other. When she spoke to the group, she mentioned one of the ways she's doing so. She'd created a makeshift mail center at the back of the room, where parents could leave each other notes throughout the week. It was simple, little envelopes pinned to a board, each with a parent's name on it. On my way out of one of sessions, I noticed a woman dropping a note into each mailbox.

Michelle: I'm writing one for everyone.

Danielle: Aww. These are notes that...

Michelle: Oh, shit, look what I did. I wrote it on two sides. What a dope.

Danielle: This is Michelle. She has long curly gray hair and wears t-shirts. She's 52, which makes her one of the older moms at the camp. And I don't know if it's age or life experience or just her, but she has a very calm vibe.

What did you write on them?

Michelle: All different stuff, you know, like, "Be well, or "Less is more," or "It's a good day to have a good day."

Danielle: Michelle's a nurse practitioner. Her son was diagnosed with ADHD about six years ago, but at the time, she didn't suspect she had it. In 2019, she started a post-grad course in psychiatric mental health. The coursework included the DSM when they got to the pages on ADHD, the descriptions felt familiar. She sent a photo to her mom, her ex-husband, and a few close friends who have known her at different points in her life. Did any of them think Michelle fit the criteria?

Michelle: And my mom came back and she was like, "I don't really know, you only fit like six here and five there, you know? And then my ex-husband pretty much had similar reaction, "Well, you'll only fit some of them, not all of them. But you fit a lot of them."

Danielle: She learned that people with ADHD have a 60 percent higher rate of developing addiction. She was about four years sober at that point and part of a support group called Healthcare Providers with Addiction. The group met weekly. They knew her well. So, she asked them what they thought about her possibly having ADHD.

Michelle: And they lost it. And they were just like "I had really really upsetting negative reactions," they were like "The medicine's addicting, what are you thinking? You shouldn't diagnose yourself," and blah blah blah, and it was like, I just couldn't believe the response. So, I kind of left it and, you know, like a couple of months went by, a girlfriend of mine came over and she was watching me around my room, my kitchen, and she said, "Do you have ADHD?"

And she's like a retired social worker. And I said, "Well, I do fit a lot of the criteria." And I told her about my group experience, and then, you now, and then she was like, "Your son got it somewhere."

Danielle: Her group was wrong. Research shows that the medications most commonly used to treat ADHD are not addictive when used properly. The drugs have also been shown to have significant benefits in reducing substance abuse and in helping people with ADHD who are in recovery to maintain sobriety. Unfortunately, her group's response is not uncommon in recovery groups.

Michelle was wise to continue the conversation, and her friend was right. ADHD is highly genetic. Many parents pass it on to their children. She and her friend talked through it, and Michelle took an online self-assessment. It came back as hyperactive, with some inattention and impulsivity. She brought the report back to her addiction support group.

Michelle: And I said, this is the evidence, and they were like, " I can't believe you're falling for that online stuff, it's such crap."

Danielle: Hearing that the support group, a group of healthcare workers, rejected the idea of ADHD, makes me wonder how many people remain undiagnosed. We ask so many questions about overdiagnosis. What about underdiagnoses, particularly among groups who stand to benefit from understanding correlations between things like addiction and ADHD? Michelle's support group twice rejected the possibility that she has ADHD, and then she rejected them. She dropped out of the group. She took the assessment results to a psychiatrist.

Michelle: The psychiatrist I ended up seeing was like, "And no one has told you you had ADHD?" And I was like "I know, right? Isn't that weird?"

Danielle: The psychiatrist diagnosed Michelle, and things started to change. For years, she said, she'd been trying to stay above water, running from fire to fire. She joked that she had been diagnosed with BAD, bad, in elementary school, and things progressed accordingly.

Michelle: Because by the time middle school and high school came, I had complete disinterest in school. And that's not normally the language I use for it.

Danielle: What's the language you normally use?

Michelle: The fuck its, I had the fuck its. I just didn't want to do any work. I wanted to hang out, you know, smoke pot in the bathroom, smoke cigarettes, we could smoke in school, cigarettes. And you know, just have fun and socialize. But I didn't wanna do any of the work.

Danielle: Michelle did enough work to finish college and nursing school. She got married. She got divorced. She got sober at 45 and was diagnosed with ADHD at 50. Two years later, she can see the difference the diagnosis and treatment have made in her life.

Michelle: I'm not running crisis to crisis anymore, you know, and I don't know if that was more my alcoholism and certainly the ADHD, because even after I got sober, I still had crises, like, often. But I'm not angry anymore. Not resentful anymore. I mean, I've come kind of a long way in two years.

Danielle: Michelle still occasionally grieves for what she called lost potential, for what could have been, had she or her parents or teachers or others known of her ADHD earlier, but she said she generally feels good about where she's at. It strikes me that the impact of Michelle's understanding extends beyond her personal growth. Michelle now works in community health care. She said she sees many patients who have been incarcerated or have been struggling with substances for years, and many of them exhibit signs of undiagnosed ADHD.

She talks to them about it, and many say they've never known certain behaviors are at all linked to ADHD. She told me she has these conversations many times each week, and that it's helpful for them to know they are not alone. Michelle is treating people in communities where access to ADHD treatment is often lacking.

I've tried to find community organizations or public health officials who are focusing on ADHD in underserved populations, particularly women, but have so far failed to find any. Michelle is the closest I've found to someone who is working with at-risk populations who stand to benefit from ADHD treatment. I wonder how much the diagnosis rates would rise if more people in underserved communities could access mental health care.

I went to this camp hoping to speak with recently diagnosed women. I wasn't sure what I hoped to learn. I confirmed that many deficiencies in care still exist for women with ADHD in all sorts of circumstances. Regardless of where they live or what they look like, their care depended largely on their provider. Throughout the week, I met women coming to terms with their needs and demanding better care. And I think this collective demand is the biggest reason diagnosis is on the rise.

Women are demanding more from our health care system. And even when the system provides, they're seeking out knowledge and information and help from each other. Even then, it's not like everything is suddenly OK. On my last day at camp, I sat in on the parents' morning session. I noticed Tamsin standing at the back of the room with her shoes off, pressing her feet into the ground. She looked exhausted. Afterwards, I asked her how she was feeling. She said listening to people talk about how they've turned their lives around, how they're now eating well and exercising and sleeping, it was all getting a bit overwhelming.

Tamsin: The very thing they're trying to get me to stop, which is those negative thoughts, just seem to be even worse. Because I'm like, oh, you know, if I'd have known sooner or if I was different or if I was better. But at the same time, I'm trying not to do it. And then there was another thing like, "Oh, when you do exercise, make sure it's different exercises and have variety and try different things. Oh, but make sure you do this consistently and have structure and scaffolding."

And it's like, my brain's just like, "Oh, I can't be bothered." Maybe I just won't do any of it. And then I'm like, "Oh, but that's ADHD as well." So, I'm just feeling a little bit nervous about being able to be better. And I think I'm a bit nervous as well about because my husband's here, like, yeah, like getting home and him being like, you know, the story we heard the first day of, "Oh, now you know all this. Now you can pick your clothes up off the floor." And it's like, no, that's not how it works.

Danielle: That's not it works at all.

Tamsin: I'm trying not to beat myself up too much. Like that's the best I can hope for. Like I'm not gonna go home and clean my whole house, but I might. But, you know, I'm not going to, like, do it forever. Like, I am still going to be me. I'm still going be a little bit crap at everything. But maybe I just won't be so hard on myself about it. Is that where you are as well?

Danielle: That's the way I felt for at least the first few months of knowing I have ADHD. People say a problem with ADHD is perfectionism. Well, when you start to hear that there are ways to tame your ADHD, it's very easy to try to perfectly tame your ADHD. And then that, in turn, adds to the overwhelm. Tamsin seemed to be coming to this realization at the camp.

Tamsin: But also, it's like, as much as I don't want to do anything to kind of make myself better, at the same time I'm like, I'm doing loads and I've got a label and a diagnosis, but everyone else is like, everyone else really annoys me. And I don t think that's because of my ADHD. I think other people are annoying. They just haven't got a label. You know, so it's why do I have to take the rap for everything? Like, just because there's a smaller percentage of people with ADHD in the world doesn't mean we're the only ones that are messing up and being annoying.

Danielle: She seemed excited to be piecing this all together. Excited and not entirely sure what to do with these thoughts.

Tamsin: We're often told that like the good part about ADHD is like the creativity and the out-of-the-box thinking and all the good stuff that we can do and and the energy and the like the reflection and stuff. So, you know if we're that good, why can't we like be more supported? Like why aren't we given more of a space to like go about on the floor if we want to? You know?

Danielle: Yeah.

Tamsin: Just like metaphorically.

Danielle: Tamsin was just two weeks into knowing about her ADHD when we spoke. Already, she was feeling things Sari Solden felt 30 years ago.

Tamsin: Well, I think I have some anger already, which just kind of plays into it just like being a woman in the world already. I'm always already a bit annoyed about the way women are treated. So now, being a women and having ADHD, it's like this double whammy of like being annoyed about the way the world is, right?

Danielle: Yeah.

Tamsin, Elaine, Michelle, and about a dozen other women helped me understand the impact of the rise in diagnosis and the importance of treatment. They were all at the camp for their children, but left with a significant level of self-understanding. Even with this opportunity, this ADHD retreat of sorts, they're struggling with care. What does that mean for everybody else?

Thinking about the ongoing deficiencies in care, and how many women may never have the opportunity to connect with others the way I witnessed women connecting at the camp, it's a bit depressing.

There's one more conversation I want to share. It left me thinking less about care and more about the overall impact of the rise in diagnosis, specifically the multi-generational impact.

Nancy: So, I'm Nancy and I've come to this school with my granddaughters and my daughter.

Danielle: I met Nancy's daughter one morning, and she told me her mom was back at the hotel. Then she said her mom also has ADHD. And of course, I asked if I could talk to her. We sat on a bench next to a creek. Nancy is 74 years old. She described several classic elements of a life with undiagnosed ADHD. She did well in school. She became a people pleaser. She went into nursing. She started drinking too much. She's 17 years sober now. Overall, she said, she has had a wonderful life.

Nancy: Everything is hard. My struggle made me feel not good enough. I kept thinking, "Why do I worry about people loving me when I have no evidence of people not loving me?" It was just really, really hard, harder than it probably needed to be, had I had a clue what was going on.

Danielle: In her 50s, a doctor suggested she might have ADHD, but said he couldn't tell because she also had anxiety. When she retired and the feelings persisted, she was diagnosed. She tried several treatments. Nothing seemed to help. Then a few years ago, her granddaughter was diagnosed, then her other granddaughters, then her daughter, Colleen. Nancy had never told Colleen about her ADHD diagnosis. Now she did. And as Colleen started working through appropriate treatments for herself and her girls, Nancy got curious.

Nancy: So, right now, I'm on the quest for a new psychiatrist and an ADHD coach.

Danielle: Throughout our conversation, she vacillated between regret and a certain wisdom that comes with age.

Nancy: I was born in 49, and it wasn't a diagnosis then. And some days I get really angry that I was born too soon, that they didn't have the diagnosis. And I can get really angry about that and really sad and like, I feel like my life has been so much more difficult than it had to be. But then, I think, you know, I was born, they had found the treatment for polio. They found the treatment for tuberculosis and all the vaccines. So, I have to temper it, that I did benefit from a lot of medical successes.

And that's the way life is. They didn't know about this. Thank goodness that people were working on it. Thank goodness it moved from just a little boys' problem to people's problems, and that women are being seen. Do I wish science had worked on it a little quicker and harder? Sure. Am I upset about the gender discrimination in the diagnosis? I'm really angry about that.

So, just recently, I've had a lot of anger and frustration in not finding the what I think is the appropriate caregivers for me. I'm just happy that my daughter's getting it. And I'm super happy that my granddaughters are getting it. You know, that's just the way of the world. So, you there's been progress made.

Danielle: There's been progress made. Speaking to Nancy helped me see more clearly the importance of that progress. When women are diagnosed and treated appropriately, entire families benefit. This might be the greatest impact of the rise in diagnosis, breaking generational cycles, or it has the potential to be. That'll depend on whether an effort is made to correct deficiencies in care and to expand access to appropriate treatment.

After speaking with Nancy, it was time to leave this idyllic setting, to pack up my rental car and head back to New York and all the pressures of modern life. I walked out to the beach and watched the sunset over Lake Michigan. I thought for a moment about what it would be like to live in a world more friendly to ADHD. It was only later, months later, that I realized one more thing I learned at the camp. Every woman I spoke to was diagnosed in her 40s or 50s. I attributed this to deficiencies in care and a long history of gatekeepers rejecting the differences between the ways women and men experience ADHD.

Then, as I started to listen to the recordings from camp, I came across a story Sue Hallowell told on the first day and something clicked. Sue shared it as the parents were gathering in a big conference room for the first time. Here's the story.

Sue: Not only does Ned have ADHD, all three children have ADHD of various types. So, we've seen lots of struggles over the years of different kinds. And our dog, I used to say our dog had ADHD as well. And I probably have ADHD, I think I have ADHD too. Mine was very masked, and it became more pronounced actually when I went through perimenopause and menopause, which is actually very common for a lot of women who have been able to maintain their symptoms.

Danielle: She told the parents how she arrived at her late diagnosis of ADHD.

Sue: I was going through perimenopause, I knew I was having trouble in ways with organization and paying attention that I really had and particularly dealing with multiple tasks at once.

Danielle: Sue said her youngest son was still in high school at the time. Every morning, she'd lay out his ADHD medications and her vitamins.

Sue: One morning, I wasn't paying attention and I took his medicine instead of mine, and I took it and I panicked and I called Ned and I said, "Ned, what's going to happen to me?" And he said, "Nothing." Well, I had the best day of my life. It was remarkable. And then I decided I should, you know, get a test, and I did, and sure enough.

Danielle: Sure enough, she has ADHD, and she never knew it, despite being married to one of the world's leading experts on ADHD, raising children who have it, and counseling couples who are dealing with it. Of the recently diagnosed women I talked to at the camp, most didn't have access to information about ADHD or awareness of it. Some were misdiagnosed. I thought these were the reasons why they weren't diagnosed with ADHD until their 40s or 50s.

Sue had access all along. Her symptoms were there all along, but they didn't impair her. So, she didn't consider it. Then she hit perimenopause and her symptoms became impairing. Like Sue, thousands of women report developing, or at least noticing, symptoms of ADHD when they hit perimenopause and menopause. Did they have ADHD all along? Or is it possible that perimenopause and menopause can tip women from the ADHD trait end of the spectrum to the disordered end of the spectrum?

If so, is it possible that this, along with increased acceptance and awareness of how ADHD presents in women, could account for some of the rapid rise in diagnosis we've seen over the last few years? That's next time on "Climbing the Walls."

"Climbing the Walls" was written and reported by me, Danielle Elliot. It was edited by Neil Drumming. Sound design by Cody Nelson. Briana Berry was our production director. Ash Beecher was our supervising producer. And Diana White was our associate producer. Fact-checking by Mary Mathis. Research by Karen Watanabe. Our music was composed by Kwame Brant Pierce, with additional music provided by Blue Dot Sessions, and our mixing was done by Justin D. Wright.

The series was brought to you by Understood.org, a nonprofit organization dedicated to empowering people with learning and thinking differences like ADHD and dyslexia.

From Understood.org, our executive directors are Laura Key, Scott Cocchiere, and Seth Melnick. A very special thanks to Rae Jacobson, Julie Zeitz, Jordan Davidson, Sarah Greenberg, and Kathleen Nadeau. If you want to help Understood continue this work, consider making a donation at Understood.org/give.