Comedian Taryn Delanie Smith’s wild ADHD ride

Cold-calling strangers about Brazilian butt lifts wasn’t exactly the plan. But for Taryn Delanie Smith — comedian, actor, former Miss New York, and creator of the viral TikTok character “Denise, Heaven’s Receptionist” — the detours turned out to be the whole story.

In this episode, Taryn talks about competing in the Miss America pageant with undiagnosed ADHD, the curses and gifts of ADHD, a learning disability in math, and struggling in corporate America. Plus: justice sensitivity, farting around time, and why waitressing might be the perfect job for an ADHD brain.

• Listen: What’s so funny about ADHD? (Comedian Jim Tews’ story)

• Read: ADHD and creativity

• Watch: What is dyscalculia?

Taryn Delanie Smith: When you start your day really early, you give yourself a lot more time to make up for what I call fart-around time. I need a lot of fart-around time, okay? Otherwise known as piddling around, shuffling around like an old wizard. These are things that are important to me. I need the extra buffer.

Laura Key: Hi everyone and welcome back to "ADHD Aha!," the show where people share the moment when it finally clicked that they had ADHD. My guest today is Taryn Delanie Smith. She's an actor and comedian, and maybe you've seen her — she has millions of followers across social media. Taryn, welcome to the show. I'm so excited to have you here and so nice to meet you and to have you here in person.

Taryn: I'm so excited too. Your set is so calm and neutral. This is not overstimulating at all. That was obviously on purpose.

Laura: It was on purpose. We also have our hors d'oeuvres, our fidget toys here.

Taryn: Which I've never seen on any — which one did you pick today? I don't even know. Oh, good. I can't help myself. But I'm nervous too because the first thing you fix in media training is fidgeting. And so that was physically painful.

Laura: I mean, I can't even imagine, Taryn. I mean the intense media training too. I mean, because you are a Miss America first runner-up and Miss New York. I mean the amount of poise and no fidgeting, stand up straight, sit up straight. I can't even imagine — that sounds — I mean to me personally, that sounds like a nightmare. Was that a nightmare for you?

Taryn: When I was — and it started when I was about 17. So I started in like the most intense media training you could ever imagine at 18 because it's a competition. So it's not just media training that you have for TV and film, it's competitive media training, I would describe it as. So, yeah. When I was, you know, 17, 18, 19, often feeling like I'm failing at something that I know I can be good at, which was interviewing and public speaking, and feeling like I was failing for things that were very difficult for me to curtail or change about myself, which was my natural want to, like, move, fidget, ramble. So I'm better at it. But right now, this is really unique and fun because I'm like, God, I wonder what it would have been like if in — when I was in school I could have, like, done this, like, played with things. That is so nuts.

Laura: How did you manage to get through that, though, the media training? What did you do? Was there, like, a trick that you had in your head?

Taryn: I would just say I became singularly motivated and fixated on becoming good at this thing. And I do actually think that that is an ADHD thing that is a gift too. ADHD comes with curses and it comes with extraordinary gifts. And I would say that's the gift is that I can, when I want something, I can fixate on it like no one else. I can fixate on it for years. It's literally how I learned French. It was because I became so obsessed. Oui, je parle français très bien. Oh oui, mon mari est français. Oh oui, alors.

So, like, just stuff like that. I think that ADHD can be such a gift because you while I struggle to focus, especially on things I do not want to do or things that I fail at, focusing on things that I know I can be good at or that I know I'm going to excel at becomes — it's fun to be able to, like, disappear into a goal.

Laura: With all that masking, though, and all that fixating, it's got to be so exhausting. Did you ever get burnt out? Like for me, when I get home at the end of the day and — I'm lucky because I work here and we have fidget trays, you know? And so it's super easy for me to be myself. But even still, I come home and I'm like, I am so overwhelmed and overloaded from just, like, being on all day because, like, you have extra hurdles to jump through in your brain when you have ADHD. It must have been hard for you.

Taryn: There's so much more information now thanks to — I mean social media, say what you will about it, but it has been such an effective learning resource for me because before I was diagnosed with ADHD, I was just labeled as — I was anxious and hyper. Like that was a huge part of my identity. But now I can understand.

I think the diagnosis even allows me to put a name to — I am just completely overwhelmed and I need to, like, disassociate for a little while because I'm so overwhelmed, I'm burned out from the amount of energy it took me today to, you know, move through the world. I don't know if that one's ADHD, maybe that's just being a human. I don't know which is which.

Laura: I think maybe a little bit of both. ADHD is real. And that's what a lot of what we're here to, you know, to validate for our listeners is that the shame that you feel, the burnout that you feel — it is harder when you have ADHD. But yeah, it is — it's also hard to be a human today in today's world.

Taryn: Yeah. And at a young age, I was diagnosed with a learning disability separate from ADHD. And so I do also think that we put a lot of stock in, oh, well, it's just my learning disability. But that didn't always explain, like, why — well, why am I so anxious and why do I have such intrusive thoughts when I'm trying to focus on something else?

(07:44) Taryn discusses her early life experiences with learning disabilities and school.

Laura: Well, let's talk about your diagnosis. So, you were diagnosed as an adult.

Taryn: Yes.

Laura: Tell me what was going on. What led to your ADHD evaluation and diagnosis?

Taryn: Yikes. Again, I always knew I was super hyperactive and anxious, especially becoming a young professional, going through college. I was acutely aware of my learning disability and so I was always like, the last thing I need is yet another label that makes me feel bad about myself.

I'm getting my master's online at this point because of COVID. And I was working in a call center, which I was really failing at that job bad. And I started TikTok. And I start making videos as a comedian and I start making funny videos and doing characters.

They're very, very funny. Everyone go check them out if you haven't heard them. Except my second video I ever made went viral. So I hadn't really been online that long. And I started getting this comment over and over: "We love an ADHD queen," or people being like, "I love to see another girlie with ADHD out here, like, we should meet up or we should get a drink, like ADHD Anonymous." And I was like, why do you guys think I've got ADHD?

And I had joked to my mom, who just gave me a long look, because my mom's been like, "You should get tested for ADHD for years." But I was like, whatever. And then I was like, fine. I happened to also be struggling with my mental health at the time, so I got therapy. And it was that therapist when I brought this up to her. And I'm like, "And everyone keeps saying I've got ADHD." And my therapist was like, "Yeah, I can totally see why they would say that because you are like a textbook case. I'm surprised you're surprised." And I was like, "No, I'm not that surprised." But what I was surprised by was once I just was at peace with the label, how empowering that was.

Laura: Yeah. What changed in your brain with that label?

Taryn: I spent a lot of time feeling like I have to prove to people that I'm smart. You're parceling through a lot of shame all the time. And because — well, like one, there are just things that are harder for you that do not seem to be hard to other people. Why? Why is this so much harder for me than the people around me?

And then, you know, like, why is being on time — why is time management so difficult for me? Why? You were early for this interview, I just want to — I was early for this interview. I'm looking at my camera. I was early, thanks. Working on that. I'm now 29. I've had some years to work on this. But yeah, why is time management so hard for me? Why do I feel like a mess all the time?

And I can joke about it and I do joke about it, but I would be lying to you if I said that there wasn't a constant kind of shadow behind me all the time of the shame of things don't seem to come as easily to me as they do to people that I really respect and admire.

Laura: Before we started the recording, we were chatting a little bit about growing up and being in school and just feeling dumb.

Taryn: Yeah.

Laura: You had an IEP.

Taryn: Yes.

Laura: An Individualized Education Program for those who don't know what that stands for. For the learning disability specifically related to math.

Taryn: To math, right. Yeah. So I struggle with numbers, I don't know my times tables. Not for lack of trying. I've tried. I've got my fives down and that's about it.

Laura: Did you just say you have your fives down?

Taryn: Yeah, 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 30, 35, 40. That's all you need. Yeah, just round. The nines are the worst. No, nines are easy because you can use your hands like this. Have you used this trick before?

Laura: Oh, no. Show me.

Taryn: Like nine times four. I go 1, 2, 3, 4 is 36.

Laura: Stop. I got to teach my kids this.

Taryn: This is what happens when you're neurodivergent. You find ways to survive. I am very good at calculating the tip on the bill now, but it takes me extra time. But, you know, it's this level of everyone at the table even as an adult, right, is watching me labor a little longer over the — the bill than them.

These are the small things that when I was much younger were humiliating. Of course. And then kids are cruel, so they make sure it's humiliating. You know what I mean? People comment, they make fun of you, they make jokes. And being a funny kid, so much of my humor is derived from I was just trying to get the dig in before and anybody else could. So I was the first person to joke about me being stupid.

It took me getting older to have people, kind of — kind people, other grown-ups to being like, "You're the person who's saying it first." A lot of the time other people aren't thinking this. Yeah. But there are habits that you get into to survive and to cope and to feel all right. The shame is conditioned from a young age when you are behind your peers and it's obvious.

And it was weird because I would excel in other places in school. I was always, you know, reading way above my grade level. I was reading at, like, you know, a collegiate level when I was in high school. I loved Dickens. I loved "Pride and Prejudice." I was really excelling in some of these classes and, you know, I was taking, like, college-level French courses. I was doing really well linguistically. Language has always been a friend of mine. And then numbers — it wasn't just that numbers were hard for me, it was concerning for my teachers like how behind I was in math.

Laura: Right. There are a lot of different threads here, right? So you excelled in language, literacy. I'm going to guess that you're very interested in those topics as well.

Taryn: Totally. Loved them.

Laura: Right. And then you've also with math, when you struggle with math, you can also develop — I developed, oh my God, so much anxiety. And then with the ADHD and anxiety, even though you had — you weren't diagnosed with ADHD at the time, it just compounds and compounds and compounds. It's this vicious cycle, right?

Taryn: Yes.

Laura: And then that just becomes a part of your identity that you're grappling with as a grown-up, of the shame.

Taryn: The shame, the fear. You're sitting there thinking, I know I can do this. I know I can be good at this. I just need to hope that everyone else in the room will give me grace. And over my life, that's not always guaranteed. But I do think it makes you a far more gracious person. I'm grateful for that. When I see someone else struggling with whatever, my heart bleeds for them because I know how it feels. And so it's not hard for me to, you know, make room for them to — I hope I'm successful at that. I really try to be. I'm not a perfect person, but I'd like to think that when I see it, when I realize it's happening in front of me with someone else, it has made me a far more gracious person. There's nothing I like to say more than, "Take your time. It's all right. I'm not in a rush." You know what I mean? And the amount that I needed to hear that throughout my life. Right, you know?

It's the topic that we have explored on the show before, it's just the deep empathy that can come and the deep, like, justice sensitivity that can come when — I just realized I found out what that was, like, two years ago and it, like, changed my life. Yeah. I don't have data to support this, but I have a lot of anecdotal, you know, and conversations with people with ADHD and just how that is just such a strong thread through their story because they've experienced so much failure growing up or so many negative messages that it makes them naturally kind of what you said, like, I — take your time. It's okay. Or want to help people. Yeah.

I also am thinking about the — it's a hurtful and common misconception that people with ADHD and learning disabilities aren't smart. Right? It's not about intelligence. These things aren't — it's about the way that your brain is wired and the way that you process information is essentially what it comes down to. Yeah.

And I think one of the more — I, speaking from my own experience, one of the more painful things to deal with as someone with ADHD has been being so aware of the mistakes that I make. I almost wish that I were ignorant to them because it would be less painful. So, being so aware and constantly trying to curtail them or explain them away.

I imagine that comedy — like there's comedy there too. Like, I'm going to make a joke about this before anybody else can, right? Just kind of outsmarting people, like, I'm part of this joke.

Taryn: Of course. If you're laughing with them, then they can never laugh at you. That is not a healthy coping — I'm looking at the camera — that's not healthy. You have to stop it. But it worked for me. So what do you want me to say? Like when I worked in corporate America, I struggled. This was not a good place to be making jokes about how ineffective I am as an employee. "Hey, my bad."

(13:16) Taryn reflects on her unconventional career path, from cleaning houses to working in a call center.

Laura: Tell me about working in a call center.

Taryn: Call center? With ADHD? So you had to make — your quota was, like, something crazy. It was 106 to 118 calls a day.

Laura: About what? Can you share that?

Taryn: I was doing cold calls because I worked — oh God. Can I be clear? This was a job that I — okay, I was cleaning houses. I'm going to give you guys the full context.

Laura: I love that you're looking to camera. What a pro.

Taryn: If you make this a clip, you need to give the full context. I lost my job as a waitress during the pandemic, all right? And then I was cleaning houses, really dirty houses in Brooklyn. It was rough. I had a hard time. Picked up a mop, cockroaches came out of it. I was like, this is it. I will take any job. I made a vow. And I got a job selling BBLs.

Laura: Wait, that butt lifts?

Taryn: Brazilian Butt Lifts. Yes, ma'am. Yes, ma'am.

Laura: Wait, you're cold-calling for butt lifts?

Taryn: Like — well, people inquired about them. I wasn't just calling random people like, "Do you want a BBL?" People would send in the inquiry. They're like, "I want a quote. How much is a BBL?"

Laura: Oh, so they okay, so.

Taryn: Or they'd be like, "I want to know how much a fat transfer." Yeah, it sounds like — these were — you could like transfer fat to your breast, stuff like that. You know? And if you want, diva, do you! Whatever. Who am I to judge? No judgment, it's just, you know, it's funny. So the point is is you have a little pamphlet of information and when people would call in to this huge company, they would just ask for, like, information on it. And that was all I did all day.

Laura: Was it fun? Were you having fun?

Taryn: No. No, no. It was horrible. And I didn't do well because — I'm a good salesperson if I believe in the thing and I think it's wonderful. But the moment somebody at the end of a call would go, "Hh, you know, I'm on the fence. Do you think I should do it?" I'd always be like, "It's really up to you. I don't think you need it, but live your life, diva." And they were like, "Stop doing that." And I was like, "Sorry."

I also think when you have ADHD, you find ways to mitigate and to make up for where you struggle. Any job that was really detail-oriented and required a lot of organization, I struggled at. And I knew I wouldn't do well at that job. And so when I had an opportunity to, like, answer phones, I was like, I am great with talking to people. I can do this job. The only thing that I found fun about that job, even though I hated the company — I just hated everything about it. I hated the company I worked for, I'm not afraid to say that. Like I didn't like any of it. I love talking to people.

I really — and I would end up not meeting my quota for calls because I would take way too long on these calls. That was a note I got over and over again. It's like, "Taryn, uh, we don't know who you are, but we are seeing that you are not really talking about the product. You're, like, chatting with people about their kids."

Laura: Can you remember? What did you end up chatting — just their kids? Yeah.

Taryn: All the time. And then they'd call back and I'd be like, "Oh my God! And how did that haircut go? Because I know you were heading off to it." I love it. I — you know, it was — that was fun for me. I loved chatting with people about their lives and getting to know them and connecting with people. I think I was looking for — I wanted to just find my way in the world. I wanted to do something that mattered in a way that at least was helping people, even just to feel all right. To feel good about themselves, whatever.

Laura: You made so much meaning out of your call center job selling BBLs.  I mean that as a compliment. I'm not even trying to make a joke. This is important for people with ADHD to find a way to make this high interest and high value and really important something that you can fixate on and for you it was the people relationships. That's really beautiful. That's one of the beautiful things about ADHD in my mind.

Taryn: Yeah, I suppose so. I think ultimately I thought, you know, I need this job because I have to pay my rent. And there's that too. But ultimately I was like, I have to find some kind of meaning in this to try to live in my purpose. And the only thing that I could find in that was at least I can make people feel wanted. When I was a waitress, same thing. I was selling wings and bringing beer to tables. But I loved waitressing.

Laura: I did too. I waitressed for years. It's — I think my favorite job I've ever had. Me too. Waitressing was my favorite job because I got to chat with people and I got to spend time with the people. I would end up sitting at the table with people if I had down moments. And that's rewarded in that profession.

Taryn: Totally. Totally. And so I think just over the years I just always found my way and you find jobs, roles, positions, opportunities where you can shine despite the odds. And I think that there's a perseverance that you develop with any form of neurodivergence because you know that you're special, that you can do something with your life. You just got to figure out what it is and how you're going to make it work, because there are some things we really struggle with that everyone else doesn't seem to be. So I have to find my niche.

(20:19) Taryn shares her strategies for managing time and the importance of sleep for ADHD brains.

Laura: So tell me about the ADHD behaviors and symptoms that are the most challenging for you and how have they popped up in your life?

Taryn: I would say time management I struggle with. It's hard. We live in a society in which being late is considered a disrespect and it is considered rude. I won't go off into the weeds about that, about what — well, is it disrespectful? Ultimately, it is the societal norm. To be on time is to show that you are reliable, you can take this seriously, and that you want to be there. That's the bare minimum. I know that that's true.

Anybody listening to this podcast who struggles at time management knows you can still be late and very much want to be there and it is very important to you. Trust me, I am just as mad at myself that I'm struggling to be on time or that I, you know, I struggle to do this in the time that you want me to do it. I am just as frustrated as you are, person who's annoyed at me for not — for being bad at time management.

Laura: Probably more frustrated.

Taryn: Probably more frustrated and more stressed out about it and more — yeah. And even more ashamed that I can tell that you think that you're not at — this is not important to me, because it is so important. That's something that follows me and has followed me throughout my life and now I'm working on it.

There are a couple things that I have done in the last even just year that have made a huge difference. And for me, going to bed really early. So, like, before, if you wake up late, you're still going to make your 10 a.m. meeting or whatever. But now you have a lot less time in the morning to what I call fart-around time. I need a lot of fart-around time, okay? Otherwise known as piddling around, shuffling around like an old wizard.

Laura: Keep going. Keep going.

Taryn: These are things that are important to me. So if I wake up at 6:30, I now have, like, two and a half hours of fart-around time. Farting around, yeah. I need the extra buffer. Sometimes I'm just sitting looking at a wall like this. But guess what? Then I'm like, "Duh! I have a meeting in an hour!" Luckily, I've already been awake, I've had my coffee, I've eaten something. So waking up early helps actually a ton for me. It has helped me.

However, that requires you to plan almost 12 hours ahead because you got to go to bed at like 9:00 to make that happen. I don't know who you are or what's wrong. The reason you can't wake up at 6:00 is because you're up until 2 a.m. on your phone or doing a project. Stop! You don't need to hang that photo that's been sitting on your floor for the last month. Don't hang it right now.

Laura: Even when you have ADHD, though, you see all these things, like, lying around. You're like, "I'm going to do it now, I'm going to do it now."

Taryn: Don't clean the bathroom at 11:45 p.m. You don't have the time.

Laura: I got to stop watching reruns of "ER" every single night until, like, 1 in the morning.

Taryn: Exactly. Giving in to those impulses, while it feels good in the moment and it feels so important. I am absolutely someone who will start a project at 11:00 at night. 100%. At the time, I was like, this is just what feels good, this is just who I am. But it was, I think, a form of my, like, difficulty with time management popping up, yeah. Because then I'm not thinking ahead for the fact that it's going to be super hard for you to wake up by 7 tomorrow.

Laura: I think sleep is one of the most underrated things for people with ADHD to really wrangle and I think it's really hard. Falling asleep can be harder when you have ADHD and yet it's so important for your focus, for everything, for the fart-around time, which is — I totally relate to that.

Taryn: Sleep makes everything easier. You work — sleep makes all of it easier. So with that being said, time management I would say has been at the center of my frustration with ADHD. The all — the other stuff, you know, I tend to leave cabinets open. I tend to forget to, like, lock the door. I — there these are all things that are, like, annoying but because I've detached a lot of shame now at this point in my life, now I can turn around and see those things and go, "Oh, let me just right this room." It's a waste of my time to shame myself for, you know, kind of being a little tornado through my own house.

Laura: Little tornadoes. Farting around, making little tornadoes. Shuffling about like an old wizard. Do what you're going to do. I think that's the beauty of ADHD, though. Everything funny to me and everything is unexpected. Because I don't know what I'm going to do next. Hell.

Have your time management challenges, have they popped — have they caused any trouble in relationships, personal relationships or like did you like walk on the stage late in Miss America pageant or something like that?

Taryn: No. Never at a pageant. You've got, like, 28 people behind you like, "Move!" and they're going to push you out. Yeah. They're like, "Get it together!" But in my personal relationships, sure. Of course, there are people in my life that, like, really value, for example, like, you remembering their birthday. Really important to them. And it's a sign of that is not important to you that you can't remember that date.

I'm better now because now the moment I learn your birthday, we've become, you know, we've become friends, I'm going to put an alarm on my calendar, I'm going to put it on my calendar because I know it's important. But if I'm like, you know that I struggle with remembering numbers, dates, stuff like that, when I did forget someone's birthday or, you know, you know, I'm a day late wishing it, or I've even had problems where it's like by 7 p.m. I realize, oh, it's the first! That's so-and-so's birthday. Because I'm forgetful, it's caused problems in those relationships of, like, it makes them feel like, "Ugh, you're such a mess, like, you never remember this kind of stuff and I — you've let me down," which is really, really painful.

I don't think what they're asking of me is unfair at all. I guess the only thing that I would counter that with is don't — please don't make it mean that you're not important to me. I'm doing my best. But I can do better, I can do better.

Laura: Do people receive that message well?

Taryn: I think it's important when you're validating how someone feels to not immediately counter with, "You're making it mean that you're not important to me." "But you're totally important to me." Instead, opening with, "I — no, I really made a mistake here and I apologize." Just because I have ADHD, it doesn't absolve me of accountability for the ways in which I can sometimes let people down. That's important.

I have a friend that board games are really important to them. I cannot sit still for a two-hour board game. I can't. You've — it's so interesting too, because the — some of the difficulties that you've mentioned, they're all like they're ADHD-related, but they're all also kind of math-related too.

Taryn: You see me. Look away. Yeah, because it's time management, clocks, board games — hate them. Hate them. Times tables. You'll have to tie me to a chair.

Laura: Even remembering dates, right? These things can all be — like dyscalculia  is very real as well. So it's kind of compounding. I just find that really fascinating.

Taryn: Yeah. And so how you balance, like, the friend that loves board games, wants to have like a board game birthday party, okay? This seems like a small thing, but it does pop up. Like when, in friendship, the thing that is important to you, I'm going to do my best to make it important to me so that we can do that thing together, etc., etc. And I have had friends in the past that are, I can tell, very disappointed that, like, it is hard for me to, like, sit through playing their favorite game or whatever. So where's the balance here of accountability of being like, I can acknowledge that it is disappointing for you that, like, I don't want what we do to always be on my terms. That's not a friendship. That's not reciprocal or fair. But at the same time, I'm communicating to you that, like, it — it was really hard for me to play a card game with you. I also always want to be careful because I don't want it to seem like I'm using my ADHD to get out of doing things that are less fun for me. Because sometimes being part of a village is doing things that are inconvenient.

(27:41) Taryn explores the concept of justice sensitivity and its role in her advocacy work.

Laura: It really is such a balance. I'm thinking about when I have to — this is going to sound so mean, but I'm just going to be honest about it. I love my friends, I love my family. I have trouble spending a ton of time, like hours, like, "We're going to plan a day, we're going to go to the city, just you and me all day together." Because I need my fart-around time.

Taryn: I totally understand.

Laura: So if someone wants to go to the city and do something with me, I'll say, "I'm going to ride the train in by myself."

Taryn: I see. And wait, is this an ADHD thing or a human thing?

Laura: This — this is a me thing, but it's because I — it's mentally exhausting and it's related to my ADHD. I get so exhausted when I'm — I want to give somebody my all for the moment that I'm with them. But if the time that would normally be my downtime where I can let my brain relax and I don't have to think about, like, focusing on the conversation, make eye contact, don't interrupt them, make sure you show that you're, like, a good friend — all these things that are in the back of my head and maybe other people's head. I need to ride that train by myself, be there, be 100% present with my friend who I care deeply about, and then I need to ride home by myself because I need to wind down because it's exhausting for me.

Taryn: I never considered this. I am like this a little bit. I understand why you're saying it's a mixture of human and ADHD because there's some of it that is like, I want to be so connected to you when you're in front of me because I want you to feel and know that you're important to me. And some of the symptoms of my ADHD make it seem like — like when I have trouble focusing on X, Y, and Z, or I'm very much like, "Squirrel!", right? Totally. That's not me. I don't want you to make it mean that you're not important to me, because you are. Therefore, it takes extra energy to be in those spaces. So prioritizing alone time can feel, um, mean.

Laura: Well, I want to give you a chance, Taryn, to talk about what you're working on, what you're passionate about right now. You know, we were talking a little bit about justice sensitivity earlier. You're an advocate for — why don't you talk about some of the work that you're doing.

Taryn: Sure. I'm interested, though, before I talk about it. My understanding of justice sensitivity with ADHD, for me, it's just always explained why I get really fixated on, like, if I feel like I've been misunderstood or like — okay, this is a really good example. You missed a meeting. And then you're like, "I can't believe I missed that meeting. I'm so sorry. What happened?" And then it finally comes back around that so-and-so, Bill, is like, "Oh, I never sent the invite." That would explain it. And then we all move on. And your part of you was like, I can't ask for it to be acknowledged that it wasn't your fault. Like Bill is like, "Oh, this was on me." But if Bill doesn't take the time to say, "I apologize, I made a mistake."

Laura: My heart just started racing because that — it so — it bothers me so much too. Yeah. 

Taryn: And then the way it's perceived is that I feel childish that I'm like, "Can you just acknowledge that I didn't make a mistake and that you did?" I know I think of that justice sensitivity in the micro sense, like in like the day-to-day interactions and the things that people don't hold themselves accountable for. And then in the macro sense, like justice and fairness for people, you know?

With that being said, I will say I've gotten really comfortable with being like, "This is on me. I'm so sorry. I made a mistake here and I apologize." I think there's a lot of strength. There's a lot of power in being able to, like, admit when you're wrong, be sorry. I make so many mistakes in a day, though, that I have to do that. But it's difficult because at the same time I never want it to be perceived or understood that I need people — it's not that I need to be right at all. And that's often how it comes off, though.

Laura: You know what I think it is for me? And I just realized this now, so bear with me. I think that I feel maybe a sense of jealousy towards people who don't feel a need to constantly apologize and that can just move through the world and make mistakes.

Taryn: Oh my God, that is so real.

Laura: And so that bubbles up as resentment. And it bubbles up as resentment. Yeah. So interesting. And like, wow, I just — that actually was a big unlock for me.

Taryn: Really? Oh my God. We're having a therapy session. You did it. We're just farting around. I love it.

You had asked me about advocacy and I ended up sidestepping the question. I apologize.

Laura: It was a great conversation. If you want to share anything, feel free. You don't have to. I was wondering, I know that you do a lot of work in the homelessness space.

Taryn: And I do, yeah. And I would say that that is — if I'm being totally honest, that — the justice sensitivity, I get really emotional and frustrated about, of course, how unjust it is that people are unhoused and it's a failure of the system, not of the individual. But I would say everybody should be that outraged. Everyone. Everyone should be outraged whether you have ADHD or not. So I would actually say that one is a part from — from ADHD. I think 100% comes from housing is a human right. And I feel so strongly about that. And I think everybody should have a little bit more justice sensitivity when it comes to the rights of others and our neighbors. But that's just me.

Laura: Is there anything that you want to share? Anything that's coming up?

Taryn: I have a book coming out October 20th. This is "The Afterlife." It's based on my character Denise, Heaven's Receptionist. If you know her, I like her, then she has a book coming out. And if you don't, you can still totally read the book, you know? It is a book for grievers or for maybe the grief-curious and Denise takes you through what life is like in heaven. And it's a really easy, fun read, especially for any of y'all with a short attention span, trust me. You could read it in a quick sitting, which I appreciate.

Laura: Taryn, it's been so lovely to spend time with you. I've really enjoyed this. Thank you for, like, the advocacy. Thank you for coming on the show and for being candid and just being you.

Taryn: Thank you. Thank you.

Laura: Thanks for listening today. As always, if you want to share your own aha moment, email us at ADHDaha@understood.org or send a message to our voicemail inbox. You'll find a link in the show notes along with resources and links to anything we mentioned in the episode.

This show is brought to you by Understood.org. Understood.org is a nonprofit organization dedicated to empowering people with learning and thinking differences like ADHD and dyslexia. If you want to help us continue this work, donate at understood.org/give.

"ADHD Aha!" is produced and edited by Jessamine Molli. Say hi, Jessamine.

Jessamine Molli: Hi everyone.

Laura: And edited by Alyssa Shea. Video is produced by Calvin Knie. Our theme music was written by Justin D. Wright. Production support provided by Andrew Rector. Briana Berry is our production director. Neil Drumming is our editorial director. From Understood.org, our executive producers are Scott Cocchiere and Jordan Davidson. And I'm your host, Laura Key. Thanks so much for listening.